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Project: ReVamp
Topic Rating: +1 (1 votes) 
September 30, 2013
5:43 pm
AdzyKayy
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Hello to you all, ladies and gentlemen. Now I know my time on this server has been short and rather bittersweet, but after browsing through the server's many, many regions, I have come across quite a few abandoned buildings, some of which have been griefed intensely. Now I know you guys have a system for removing and reporting these builds, but I have an even better proposal; something that will take time, effort, resources, and the help from all of you fine fellows :)

Ladies and Gentlemen, I give you:

 

PROJECT: REVAMP

 

The Proposal

 

Project: ReVamp is a server improving project that aims to improve the looks and immersion of the server. This project aims to combat griefing on abandoned builds and structures, long after the event has occurred and been forgotten about. Let's face it, griefed things are ugly, and even if the owners of said 'things' are no longer with us, it's much better to refurbish these ruins instead of removing all that hard work wholesale. The project will begin with the more dire areas of the server, and will eventually cover every square kilometre of it. Buildings that are to be revamped will be attended to with great care and attention to detail. Buildings will be renovated to a standard that fits in with the original style of the building, and the region the building was found in.

 

If this project is to be given the thumbs up and approval of the owners/admins, then I kindly ask this thread to be stickied, as it will hopefully receive a lot of attention in the coming weeks.

 

The Terms and Conditions

 

This project is entirely voluntary work. You won't get paid, you will use your own hard-earned resources, and you won't be forced into doing this. There is absolutely no incentive for you to join me on this project, unless you want to see this server looking beautiful and pristine once more. I aim to reach out to those members with more than enough shillings, and who are willing to spend said shillings on resources to assist with the building. Depending on the state of play, resources from the government may also be used to improve the more important buildings. This is all about giving a little back to the community, and making it a nicer place overall. Spread your wealth! Share your love for architecture! Gain pleasure from witnessing amazing buildings and curious ruins!

 

Those who wish to join me on this project need look no further. Simply post in this thread if you wish to partake, but bear in mind that each ReVamp MUST be posted in this thread prior to it being worked on, to allow the admins to give it the go-ahead. If you attempt to rebuild areas WITHOUT permission, this will be taken as griefing, and, although you may just be trying to help, you will be punished as such. Ignorance is not an excuse, you have been warned.

 

Buildings can not just be refurbished. If a building is found that is in a pretty bad state, but would look good with a bit of artistic flair, then it will be perfectly acceptable to make the ruined area look a bit more ruined, to keep in with the lore of the server. This does not necessarily mean the build will be griefed further, but it means that it will become more visually appealing while still retaining the properties of a ruin (examples are the addition of vines and mossy cobblestone, and using stairs to give walls that broken-in feel).

 

ReVamp requests can be made by anyone and everyone. When proposing a ReVamp, you must include the following:

 

  • The Coordinates of the area

  • Screenshot(s) of the area in its current state

  • Information regarding active residences or homes that may overlap with the build

 

Once they are posted, an admin will look them over and should post in this thread with a reply to the proposal. If it is accepted, then work can begin immediately. ONLY ONE REVAMP MAY BE WORKED ON AT A TIME. If you find an area that needs an urgent clean up, you must wait until the current project is complete before starting work on it. If this project is given the go-ahead, the server admins will have control over which project is being undertaken at any given time. Upon completion of the work, a new set of screenshots will be taken to show the improvement in contrast to the original building.

 

The Team

 

I will include a list of approved individuals for the project here. These individuals should be given permission and trust to work on current builds, but if they are found working outside of the current zone, they must be moderated. If a player abuses this trust, they will be removed from the project.


------------------------------------------------------------------------------


And that's all I got folks! Feel free to post your ideas and suggestions in this thread! If it gets stickied and the project is cleared by the admins I will put some more effort into this thread, and maybe add a few pretty images too :)

October 1, 2013
1:08 pm
KlssM3Lush
North Carolina
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I personally like our server the way it is.  While VeteranCraft does have a policy of approved removals after 30 days of inactivity, that does not necessarily mean those players will not come back.  I feel abandoned structures should only be removed or "revamped" if it is directly in the way of a current player's project.  That way, if some of the builders of said ruined structures ever do come back, there will be no complications.  I just do not see a need to go around changing buildings so they will fit your standards of "beautiful and pristine."

October 1, 2013
7:09 pm
AdzyKayy
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You misunderstand me. The whole concept of this project is to fix GRIEFED buildings that have been abandoned, so as you rightly stated, if members do come back after a long absence, they don't come back to find their building in tatters, or worse still, gone completely. I don't know about you but I'd be very disheartened if I found all my hard work to have been for nothing. Whether or not the building is cleared for improvement is down to the moderators or the owners of the building. In addition, players should take into account the size of their project before building them too close to other buildings.

Oh, and my standards are arbitrary :) I have really no say in this project if it goes ahead; it'll be all down to everyone else. Whatever you believe to be the definition of "beautiful and pristine" is what it shall be my friend! But feel free to debunk this project, as I'm sure you aren't the only one with this mentality :) it was just a thought! And I was just trying to help out the community.

October 2, 2013
5:40 am
KlssM3Lush
North Carolina
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I've said all I need to say.

October 2, 2013
6:49 am
Pauli90
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This topic is rather a suggestion than a creation, isn't it.

However... to prevent griefing of structures we've a valuable tool called residence that I can very recommend. In my opinion, there's no need to renovate buildings of players who are gone or even banned. The rules clearly state: no refund in case of griefing. Also, the majority of abandoned strutures I've seen is not that beautiful to deserve a renovation.

An idea I could definitively agree with (whatever it counts) is to remove abandoned buildings as a kind of reclamation. Many places in Vetronia where I've traveled have lost their natural, wild flair just due to an ugly something installed there by someone some long time ago. Although, such reclamation projects should be organized by the community builds team and a moderator respectively who can decide whether a structure can be removed or not.

Back in my day zombies dropped feathers!
October 2, 2013
7:58 am
LightWarriorK
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This isn't a final word, there is obviously a lot of debate to be had on this topic.

However, here is my two-cents:

Pauli is absolutely correct.  We are set up to deal with these sorts of situations:

  • Griefing can be prevented by Residence.  Those who do not use it don't deserve to have their buildings renovated for them, especially not with donated materials.
  • Players should be well-informed that if they abandon their buildings and have been gone from the server for over 30 days, their structure can be removed.  Not renovated.  If they wanted to keep their building, they wouldn't have left.

Renovation as opposed to removal also causes other issues.  For one, "renovating without permission" IS a form of griefing.  The placement of blocks is just as much griefing as the removal, even if that placement is a "beautification" in the eyes of the person doing it.  To allow renovation of this sort is a slippery slope, and while staff knows where to draw the line, I can definitely see a lot of kids going wild with "Hey, this castle would look better as a ruin," or "What, you didn't want you house on fire?  But it looks so much better!"  Staff would get them, but the damage would be done.  In the end, the basic rule of the server remains:  "If it's not yours, leave it alone."

Additionally, one of the benefits of removal of old structures is the re-opening of land for development.  While there is PLENTY of open land in Vetronia, popular land can get filled in pretty quickly.  IRL, if someone moves away and their house becomes an eye-sore, you don't fix it up for them and hope they someday move back.  You either resell it, or demolish it.  In the case of Minecraft, people want to build.  We're not going to resell someone's old house.

 

Now, we HAVE in the past tried to initiate some sort of removal of older abandoned and griefed buildings.  The threads are out there in the Suggestions Forum if you want to read them.

The problem is that there wasn't a lot of interest.  I have no interest in LeFay, and Emulated has no interest in Trymaer, Pauli I'm sure has no interest in Rhodes.  It's a big world out there, and most people have enough on their plate as far as mining and building, and would rather not spend time being a janitor.

However, one option that has been used a few times is if a player dedicated to an area makes good use of the Removal Requests Forum.  I have done so for the area around Highmoor when needed, and will continue to do so.  As an SM, my ability to keep an eye on a larger area and deal with issues is enhanced.  But as an example, consider LeFay.  It was established as a "New Player Village," and at one time was a thriving community.  As those new players abandoned the server, or became established and moved on to larger projects out in the greater wild, the houses became unused.  So Blocksoldier72, who was heavily involved with the area, posted a cleanup thread to clear out the old to make way for the new.

My recommendation is to do like what Pauli said above, and if you're really invested in this, start making removal request lists for reclamation.  Go through an area, note the coordinates, and post them in the Removal Requests Forum in small batches.  Staff will be able to handle them from there and take down the structures and remove Residences, and in most cases will try and make the land look natural again.  But in no case should a non-staff member remove, improve, or modify a structure they did not make themselves.

That's just my recommendation, but feel free to keep debating the issue.Smile

EDIT: Pauli brought up another good point....thread moved to Suggestions Forum.

"Awake, oh man, and be wise." -Thoth
October 2, 2013
2:45 pm
Zakur_The_Bright
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About this idea... I really like that you have a mindset to attempt to help and improve the server, because that's what you should have. However, this idea is flawed in a few ways. I don't mean to tear apart your hard work for setting up a long idea, but I don't think this is necessarily something we actually need on the server. Most of what my points would be are up with LWK and the others, but I also have a point to add. "Revamp" is constantly done to the server. How, you ask? By removing the old structures that no one owns or wants and building new creations over the now empty space. This prevents the need to expand Vetronia any further and also can give some items to the government to work on new projects. The idea of remaking old structures to look better is a nice concept, but there's so many leftover things and such a small amount of players in comparison. After the refurbishing, what would be next? Leave it there just to make things look nice? It's more practical and in the best interest of the community that we simply remove old abandoned structures in the way to make way for new creations that make Vetronia look beautiful by being there. Not to say that I didn't like your idea, because it's really not bad and kind of selfless. However, in the end it would just be better to keep the server the way it is now, in my opinion.

-Zakur

"Kindness is a language which the deaf can hear and the blind can see." -Mark Twain
October 2, 2013
6:42 pm
sts512
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Just to throw in my two cents:

1) This idea has a lot of promise, but some buildings would be hard to renovate. If you've got a boxy cobble-dirt-wood home with an explosion torn into the side, can you really make a ruin out of it without building from the ground up?

2) We might think about initiating a system in which griefed buildings within a few dozen blocks of one players residence can be renovated if they don't plan on expanding, but again, this new system can create a lot of loopholes and hoops to jump through.

 

Regardless of community response, it is great to see people like you taking this mindset of making the server beautiful and helping the community, and we all appreciate it.

#swoloyag
October 3, 2013
10:04 am
AdzyKayy
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Pauli90 said 

This topic is rather a suggestion than a creation, isn't it.

 

However... to prevent griefing of structures we've a valuable tool called residence that I can very recommend. In my opinion, there's no need to renovate buildings of players who are gone or even banned. The rules clearly state: no refund in case of griefing. Also, the majority of abandoned strutures I've seen is not that beautiful to deserve a renovation.

 

An idea I could definitively agree with (whatever it counts) is to remove abandoned buildings as a kind of reclamation. Many places in Vetronia where I've traveled have lost their natural, wild flair just due to an ugly something installed there by someone some long time ago. Although, such reclamation projects should be organized by the community builds team and a moderator respectively who can decide whether a structure can be removed or not.

 

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Forgive me, but I asked Emulated where I should post it and he told me to post it here :(

As for the reclamation suggestion, that is more or less what I was proposing, albeit with reconstruction replacing demolition

 

In reply to LightWarriorK, I'll make sure to do that, but having already posted a removal request, I've found the job of removal to be rather messy (i.e: just wrenching the building out of the landscape leaving an awful expanse of flat land or a crater). My idea was to remove all of that entirely by simply building on top of it. If players wish to remove these then they can without permission.

 

In reply to sts, I'm pretty good at minecraft architecture (as I'm sure are a lot of members of this server), and the use of half-slabs, vines, stair blocks, and other techniques can transform a "boxy cobble-dirt-wood home" into something new. Have you ever seen the show Grand Designs? That's sort of what I'm getting at. In addition, if a building seemed slapped together with a bunch of different materials, the group in charge of the revamp will all vote on which should be the main material based on the location of the build. But that's not up to me, it's up to everyone else. I'm just initiating this idea, I'm not in charge of it.

 

Thanks for the comments, but I guess I'll just keep quiet and submit removal requests as and when I need them. It's not a case of me wanting to build on them though, it's a case of making the view out of my window much nicer than a half derelict wall of cobble. If this gets more positive interest maybe I'll think about it, but until this get's moderator approval or community contribution, I'll have to make do with the tools that I have :)

October 4, 2013
11:14 am
Pauli90
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Ok, I forgive you! Laugh

 

However, I like the idea of a beautification of Vetronia although it must be in a way of bringing back nature and wilderness to abandoned and somehow "exhausted" regions and not in a way of "Let's repair each cobble cube we find somewhere".

An example of a region that could need such a reclamation is a "city" around -2200; 4500 formerly owned by infectablegamer who is banned. As the city is partially res'ed many buildings are in an acceptable state, however, there is (and will ever be) nobody who uses or takes care of these structures anymore. The area is dead, nobody can live or build there as long as this city persists. This is why I'd ask to remove it.

On the other hand, I've no personal need of this area and probably no one else has at the moment. So, just asking staff to remove this city (and a dozen more, only because some players tell them it'd be good) would not correspond with staff's actuall tasks.

I suggest to have reclamation teams. This suggestion doesn't seem to be very new, however, I've no idea why it hasn't worked, yet. If there are one or two particular players organizing one reclamation project by hiring workers, most players, I'm sure, would be glad to get a little job. And it would be a good investment for the server, in my opinion.

Back in my day zombies dropped feathers!
October 4, 2013
5:13 pm
nak1030
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I agree with Pauli- several of the griefed structures throughout Vetronia can be considered "cobble cubes". I personally find cobblestone to be an over-used block in the game, however it makes sense why it is used in so many starter homes since, next to dirt, it is the easiest obtainable block in the game. I believe that the efforts spent on refurbishing every deteriorated cobblestone structure on the server would be efforts gone to waste. LWK brings up a good point, as well, stating that the majority of griefed structures aren't worthy of having server donated resources spent attempting to fix them.

 

While this idea seems in the best interest of the server, it appears to have too many technicalities that would be difficult to deal with. If you plan to build a home in an area occupied by a griefed object, it is far more simple to request that building be removed as opposed to trying to make an ugly building a slightly less degree of ugly.

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